329:question:329--week_4_questions_comments-2020
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The movie the Patriot can work as a secondary source due to the fact that the movie does take place in a historical setting. **But, of course, we would not rely on this movie to be a sole resource to get information from.** Just like the Last of the Mohicans, and Pocahontas it opens the conversation of the Revolutionary War via a movie that appeals to a mature audience. This movie does get some things wrong, but it also gets the clothing, music, weapon styles, and timelines correct. - Kaylee Williams | The movie the Patriot can work as a secondary source due to the fact that the movie does take place in a historical setting. **But, of course, we would not rely on this movie to be a sole resource to get information from.** Just like the Last of the Mohicans, and Pocahontas it opens the conversation of the Revolutionary War via a movie that appeals to a mature audience. This movie does get some things wrong, but it also gets the clothing, music, weapon styles, and timelines correct. - Kaylee Williams | ||
- | The film can work on a more basic level as a secondary source when looking at the specifics of the time period, such as weapons, battle tactics, architecture, | + | **The film can work on a more basic level as a secondary source when looking at the specifics of the time period, such as weapons, battle tactics, architecture, |
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+ | The movie gets a number of things wrong, but it does still get some things right. | ||
The movie, The Patriot, works as a secondary source for the Revolutionary War because it depicts the story taking place in a historical setting with a somewhat accurate timeline. There were some things that were wrong in the movie such as who was exactly fighting in a battle scene and why. The clothing, music, and weapons that were used also seem to be correct in how the characters used and wore these items. **Another aspect that was correct was the 18th century tactics that were used, such as the Guerrilla forces that helped keep the war alive in South Carolina.** This was done by using an untrained, ragtag group of militiamen that made an American victory possible by hiding out in swamps, taking advantage of the British, and outsmarting them. -Lauren Simpson | The movie, The Patriot, works as a secondary source for the Revolutionary War because it depicts the story taking place in a historical setting with a somewhat accurate timeline. There were some things that were wrong in the movie such as who was exactly fighting in a battle scene and why. The clothing, music, and weapons that were used also seem to be correct in how the characters used and wore these items. **Another aspect that was correct was the 18th century tactics that were used, such as the Guerrilla forces that helped keep the war alive in South Carolina.** This was done by using an untrained, ragtag group of militiamen that made an American victory possible by hiding out in swamps, taking advantage of the British, and outsmarting them. -Lauren Simpson | ||
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While I do not think this movie can be considered a good secondary source for the Revolutionary War as a whole, I do think it does an excellent job of portraying how the war was fought in a relatively realistic manner. I was mostly impressed by the stance it took on guerrilla warfare. When I think back on learning about the American Revolution, teachers tend not to tell you about the grittier parts of the war. They mainly focus on the Continental Army and disregard everything else. Looking at the Revolution from the angle portrayed in the film was a nice touch. Though they never use the term " | While I do not think this movie can be considered a good secondary source for the Revolutionary War as a whole, I do think it does an excellent job of portraying how the war was fought in a relatively realistic manner. I was mostly impressed by the stance it took on guerrilla warfare. When I think back on learning about the American Revolution, teachers tend not to tell you about the grittier parts of the war. They mainly focus on the Continental Army and disregard everything else. Looking at the Revolution from the angle portrayed in the film was a nice touch. Though they never use the term " | ||
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Crawford, Amy. “The Swamp Fox.” Smithsonian Magazine, June 30, 2007. https:// | Crawford, Amy. “The Swamp Fox.” Smithsonian Magazine, June 30, 2007. https:// | ||
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I think that this film could be used as a secondary source, but as others have mentioned, there are issues that the viewer should be aware of. I think that they should have an understanding of the events surrounding the Revolutionary War, and the years leading up to it. I do, however, think that the movie portrays things like costumes, dates, and places pretty accurately. I think that the film's portrayal of the British mirrors that of the British portrayal of Americans in the primary documents. Overall, I think that the film would be a pretty good secondary source. -- Mariah Morton | I think that this film could be used as a secondary source, but as others have mentioned, there are issues that the viewer should be aware of. I think that they should have an understanding of the events surrounding the Revolutionary War, and the years leading up to it. I do, however, think that the movie portrays things like costumes, dates, and places pretty accurately. I think that the film's portrayal of the British mirrors that of the British portrayal of Americans in the primary documents. Overall, I think that the film would be a pretty good secondary source. -- Mariah Morton | ||
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+ | It’s difficult to call this movie an effective secondary source. It’s good at reflecting the time period in its visuals but the character portrayals leave much to be desired. The characters are based on people who may have embodied that role during the war, but they aren’t based on real people and this becomes clear through the exaggerated characterization. The movie proves to have given up a lot for the sake of entertainment; | ||
====== II. Problems with historical accuracy? Errors in fact? ====== | ====== II. Problems with historical accuracy? Errors in fact? ====== | ||
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Hagist, Don N. British Soldiers, American War. Yardley: Westholme, 2014. -Wilson LeCount | Hagist, Don N. British Soldiers, American War. Yardley: Westholme, 2014. -Wilson LeCount | ||
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+ | The most glaring errors in historical accuracy to me was the portrayal of a Southern (from South Carolina no less) family that owned not one but two plantations and yet their African American laborers were freedmen and or treated extremely well by the family. As we've said in the previous class when discussing the Southern United States, slave labor was their primary form of labor and what they used. To have the only two real portrayals of plantation living as lacking the type of slave labor that existed at the time is to ignore the motivations of the British in offering freedom to these slaves, as vaguely and ineffectively is shown in the movie. It also ignores and glosses over the brutality and cruelty that the colonists inflicted upon their slaves and paints this idyllic plantation living that is destroyed and marred by the terrible British. The film only lightly addresses the racism of the time with offhand comments here and there about not wanting to arm slaves and about sending slaves in their place to fight, but also shows some of the perpetrators of the racist comments as magically " | ||
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====== III. How does the film’s overall interpretation(s) deviate from scholarly historical sources? ====== | ====== III. How does the film’s overall interpretation(s) deviate from scholarly historical sources? ====== | ||
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The film does not really highlight the supply shortages that were felt within the armies, militias, and even families in the colonies. Many of the continental armies were low on supplies which is supported in the readings but is not really displayed all that well in the movie. In the movie, they are often seen shooting guns at celebrations wasting the ammunition. Another idea that was mentioned in the readings and lectures but not in the movie is the idea that the British attempted to sabotage the colonies economically. In the lecture, we talked about how the British attempted to take away the Southern colony’s labor force and in the reading, the // | The film does not really highlight the supply shortages that were felt within the armies, militias, and even families in the colonies. Many of the continental armies were low on supplies which is supported in the readings but is not really displayed all that well in the movie. In the movie, they are often seen shooting guns at celebrations wasting the ammunition. Another idea that was mentioned in the readings and lectures but not in the movie is the idea that the British attempted to sabotage the colonies economically. In the lecture, we talked about how the British attempted to take away the Southern colony’s labor force and in the reading, the // | ||
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====== IV. How does this movie work as a primary source about the time period in which it was made or the filmmakers? ====== | ====== IV. How does this movie work as a primary source about the time period in which it was made or the filmmakers? ====== | ||
This movie is interesting for its time period because I think this is the recipe for a “movie dads like”. | This movie is interesting for its time period because I think this is the recipe for a “movie dads like”. | ||
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+ | I actually looked up when the movie was released because I thought the style in which it was filmed indicated it could have been made post 9/11. **I thought this could be the case because of how pro-American the movie is. It has the themes of freedom, equality, liberty, and overall portrays America in as positive a way as possible.** | ||
//The Patriot//, like all of the movies we have watched so far, is a great primary source for analyzing the American film industry and their portrayal of American history. **I feel that the overall " | //The Patriot//, like all of the movies we have watched so far, is a great primary source for analyzing the American film industry and their portrayal of American history. **I feel that the overall " | ||
- | I think that //The Patriot// is a decent source for the time period in which it was made. The level of violence is one thing that comes to mind, many movies from this time, especially ones that are meant to be violent because of their subject matter, are often played up and bloodied. There is also the ever present theme of at least one, if not more, tragic love story. There is also the theme of severely villianizing the non american side, that is not to say that the British were by any means the good guys in real life and they did do a lot of horrific things, however there is often in movies from this time, the one " | + | I think that //The Patriot// is a decent source for the time period in which it was made. The level of violence is one thing that comes to mind, many movies from this time, especially ones that are meant to be violent because of their subject matter, are often played up and bloodied. There is also the ever present theme of at least one, if not more, tragic love story. There is also the theme of severely villianizing the non american side, that is not to say that the British were by any means the good guys in real life and they did do a lot of horrific things, however there is often in movies from this time, the one " |
Roland Emmerich, the director, is infamous for his massive set pieces and hundreds of hundreds of extras. Everything that happens in this movie is pretty typical of some of his other historical movies, such as Anonymous (2011), which is about the Oxfordian theory of Shakespeare. Explosions, random love interests, lots of dirt and blood, and a romanticized version of the past. -Madison Roberts | Roland Emmerich, the director, is infamous for his massive set pieces and hundreds of hundreds of extras. Everything that happens in this movie is pretty typical of some of his other historical movies, such as Anonymous (2011), which is about the Oxfordian theory of Shakespeare. Explosions, random love interests, lots of dirt and blood, and a romanticized version of the past. -Madison Roberts | ||
- | I felt the movie showed that the United States loves to glorify the men who fought in the revolutionary war. In the US the Revolution is thought of as our beginning and to make the men who fought in it look like heros makes the US look good. I thought the scene that captured this best was when Mel Gibson grabs the flag, runs into combat, and flips the horse. | + | I felt the movie showed that the United States loves to glorify the men who fought in the revolutionary war. In the US the Revolution is thought of as our beginning and to make the men who fought in it look like heros makes the US look good. I thought the scene that captured this best was when Mel Gibson grabs the flag, runs into combat, and flips the horse. |
- | This movie was only made 20 years ago. Which doesn' | + | This movie was only made 20 years ago. Which doesn' |
- | By trying to be authentic to history, I think the filmmakers really missed their mark and created an even more fictional character. As we talked about in class, Gibson’s character is supposed to be based off of real people: Thomas Sumter, Daniel Morgan, Andrew Pickens, and Francis Marion. After the movie came out, it was especially criticized for it’s interpretation of Francis Marion, claiming it was glorifying "a serial rapist who hunted Red Indians for fun." (https:// | + | By trying to be authentic to history, I think the filmmakers really missed their mark and created an even more fictional character. As we talked about in class, Gibson’s character is supposed to be based off of real people: Thomas Sumter, Daniel Morgan, Andrew Pickens, and Francis Marion. After the movie came out, it was especially criticized for it’s interpretation of Francis Marion, claiming it was glorifying "a serial rapist who hunted Red Indians for fun." (https:// |
Overall, I think this film is a heavy reflection of the year 2000, especially what the government wanted. This was the year George W. Bush became president, after a hotly contested election against Al Gore, and only after a supreme court ruling made it so. The country was divided and angry, and needed something to rally around. Something to point to and say “this? This is what it means to be America. This is why I love this country.” In a really weird way, this is what I think The Patriot delivered in the summer of 2000. | Overall, I think this film is a heavy reflection of the year 2000, especially what the government wanted. This was the year George W. Bush became president, after a hotly contested election against Al Gore, and only after a supreme court ruling made it so. The country was divided and angry, and needed something to rally around. Something to point to and say “this? This is what it means to be America. This is why I love this country.” In a really weird way, this is what I think The Patriot delivered in the summer of 2000. | ||
--Cat Kinde | --Cat Kinde | ||
- | I think that this movie is a good representation of how war was portrayed during the 90s, very bloody and extreme. I think that it also was very negative in their portrayal of the British, and portrayed America in a very positive, benevolent light. Their portrayal of slavery was also something that really displays that type of benevolence. Overall, I believe that the movie would be a good primary source on a variety of different filmmaking aspects, some good and some not so good. -- Mariah Morton | + | **I think that this movie is a good representation of how war was portrayed during the 90s, very bloody and extreme. I think that it also was very negative in their portrayal of the British, and portrayed America in a very positive, benevolent light.** Their portrayal of slavery was also something that really displays that type of benevolence. Overall, I believe that the movie would be a good primary source on a variety of different filmmaking aspects, some good and some not so good. -- Mariah Morton |
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+ | This film can act as a pretty strong primary source for the time period it was made it. **The 90s and early 2000s were a time period where movies relied heavily on stereotypes and historical fiction movies were promoting a rhetoric which supported characters that embodied American principles.** Gibson’s character represented a form of the ideal American man. This was also an era that tended to gloss over problematic portions of history, and this is clear in the way they sugar-coated the role and presence of African Americans in this time period. African Americans weren’t treated awfully in the movie and it was even possible for some of them to earn their freedom which wasn’t something that happened back then. Furthermore, | ||
===== V. The "So, what?" question ====== | ===== V. The "So, what?" question ====== | ||
It's a shame there aren't many other movies made about the Revolutionary war, because pretty much anything could' | It's a shame there aren't many other movies made about the Revolutionary war, because pretty much anything could' | ||
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+ | As one of the only well known films about the American Revolution, sadly, this film probably comes to mind when a lot of people think about the war. While from a cinematic perspective, | ||
As mentioned above, The Patriot serves a very obviously glorified American storyline that does highlight some of the harsher sides of history but definitely glosses over others. The movie portrays the British as prideful to the point of their own destruction but also honorless, yet the colonial militiamen had morally improved since the French and Indian War despite also doing horrendous things. The movie also does not accurately portray slavery in its storyline. Someone in George Martin’s position would most certainly have enslaved people working his land, not freedmen he paid to work. While the movie certainly addressed slavery and acknowledged it existed, and even highlighted that enslaved men could earn their freedom through service in the military, it greatly lessened the hard reality of slavery in the colonies. This inaccurate representation of a great American atrocity is perpetuated in other movies and aspects in society; this movie was a major hit and it definitely impacted people‘s opinions and understanding of historical slavery and that is why it is important to analyze this movie. -Morgan Gilbert | As mentioned above, The Patriot serves a very obviously glorified American storyline that does highlight some of the harsher sides of history but definitely glosses over others. The movie portrays the British as prideful to the point of their own destruction but also honorless, yet the colonial militiamen had morally improved since the French and Indian War despite also doing horrendous things. The movie also does not accurately portray slavery in its storyline. Someone in George Martin’s position would most certainly have enslaved people working his land, not freedmen he paid to work. While the movie certainly addressed slavery and acknowledged it existed, and even highlighted that enslaved men could earn their freedom through service in the military, it greatly lessened the hard reality of slavery in the colonies. This inaccurate representation of a great American atrocity is perpetuated in other movies and aspects in society; this movie was a major hit and it definitely impacted people‘s opinions and understanding of historical slavery and that is why it is important to analyze this movie. -Morgan Gilbert | ||
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+ | Cinematically, | ||
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