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| 329:question:329--week_10_questions_comments-2020 [2020/10/29 12:16] – purnaja_podduturi | 329:question:329--week_10_questions_comments-2020 [2020/10/29 13:01] (current) – [V. The "So, what?" question] 73.40.104.245 |
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| The movie did not seem to have too many obvious misconceptions surrounding the story of Matewan. I think that the film was one of the most true-to-fact films of the semester so far. It told the story of the coal miners, their struggle with organizing the union, and the massacre that they experienced with company men versus miners. It also did a good job of explaining what happened after the film ended, and how things ended up. -Mariah Morton | The movie did not seem to have too many obvious misconceptions surrounding the story of Matewan. I think that the film was one of the most true-to-fact films of the semester so far. It told the story of the coal miners, their struggle with organizing the union, and the massacre that they experienced with company men versus miners. It also did a good job of explaining what happened after the film ended, and how things ended up. -Mariah Morton |
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| According to some of the readings, the scrip system set up by companies often broke down and exploited the supply and demand chain in these areas. People couldn't buy anything from outside producers because they didn't have money, and trade didn't really work bc company stores didn't accept cash or checks. This was a very exploitative system that was subtly explored in the way the company controlled all items and property and charged the people for every little thing. -Purnaja Podduturi | According to some of the readings, the scrip system set up by companies often broke down and exploited the supply and demand chain in these areas. People couldn't buy anything from outside producers because they didn't have money, and trade didn't really work bc company stores didn't accept cash or checks. **This was a very exploitative system that was subtly explored in the way the company controlled all items and property and charged the people for every little thing.** -Purnaja Podduturi |
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| ====== IV. How does this movie work as a primary source about the time period in which it was made or the filmmakers? ====== | ====== IV. How does this movie work as a primary source about the time period in which it was made or the filmmakers? ====== |
| //Matewan// was released in 1987, six years after the PATCO strike in 1981 (source: https://www.npr.org/2006/08/03/5604656/1981-strike-leaves-legacy-for-american-workers). On August 3, 1981, the Professional Air Traffic Controllers Organization (PATCO) union, which had supported Ronald Reagan in the presidential election, rejected the government's pay raise offer. They sent 16,000 members out on strike to shut down commercial airlines. They also demanded a reduction in the workweek, from 40 to 32 hours, 40% pay raises, early retirement, and a $10,000 bonus. Due to federal law, such strikes were illegal. The strikers were given 48 hours to return to work, or else they would be fired and banned from ever again working in a federal capacity. One fourth of the strikers came back to work, but the rest did not and were fired.The strike collapsed. PATCO vanished in the aftermath, and the union movement as a whole suffered. It was a step backwards that accelerated the decline of membership across the board in the private sector. Afterwards, unions as a whole suffered a continual decline of power during the Reagan administration.Reagan himself had been a supporter of unions, but this event made him unpopular in their circles. It is possible that this event, which was a major loss to the Labor Movement, prompted a revival of its significance in the form of this film. -- Lyndsey Clark | //Matewan// was released in 1987, six years after the PATCO strike in 1981 (source: https://www.npr.org/2006/08/03/5604656/1981-strike-leaves-legacy-for-american-workers). On August 3, 1981, the Professional Air Traffic Controllers Organization (PATCO) union, which had supported Ronald Reagan in the presidential election, rejected the government's pay raise offer. They sent 16,000 members out on strike to shut down commercial airlines. They also demanded a reduction in the workweek, from 40 to 32 hours, 40% pay raises, early retirement, and a $10,000 bonus. Due to federal law, such strikes were illegal. The strikers were given 48 hours to return to work, or else they would be fired and banned from ever again working in a federal capacity. One fourth of the strikers came back to work, but the rest did not and were fired.The strike collapsed. PATCO vanished in the aftermath, and the union movement as a whole suffered. **It was a step backwards that accelerated the decline of membership across the board in the private sector. Afterwards, unions as a whole suffered a continual decline of power during the Reagan administration**.Reagan himself had been a supporter of unions, but this event made him unpopular in their circles. It is possible that this event, which was a major loss to the Labor Movement, prompted a revival of its significance in the form of this film. -- Lyndsey Clark |
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| This film can definitely be considered a primary source to John Sayles the director. A website/blog post I read about this film talked about how Sayles made a book about this film entitled Thinking in Pictures: The Making of the Movie Matewan which came out in 1987. Supposedly in the book Sayles talked about how in the late 1960s he hitchhiked through this region which led him to become interested in West Virginia’s coal-mining district, its people, and their traditions. From this experience, Sayles was exposed to the miner's world and the different music, regional accents, and numerous local characters incorporated into this film. http://www.films42.com/feature/november_feature.asp -Megan Williams | This film can definitely be considered a primary source to John Sayles the director. A website/blog post I read about this film talked about how Sayles made a book about this film entitled Thinking in Pictures: The Making of the Movie Matewan which came out in 1987. Supposedly in the book Sayles talked about how in the late 1960s he hitchhiked through this region which led him to become interested in West Virginia’s coal-mining district, its people, and their traditions. From this experience, Sayles was exposed to the miner's world and the different music, regional accents, and numerous local characters incorporated into this film. http://www.films42.com/feature/november_feature.asp -Megan Williams |
| https://millercenter.org/reagan-vs-air-traffic-controllers | https://millercenter.org/reagan-vs-air-traffic-controllers |
| -Morgan Gilbert | -Morgan Gilbert |
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| | **Matewan has been the least “Hollywoodized” film we have watched so far.** The fault of using fictional characters can be justified for its purpose of making historical figures real people. The dialogue and ambiance are meant to be representative of the time period and puts you in the place rather than shows you. The film’s release date of 1987 would be interesting to study in comparison to the film’s creation. The era of Reagonomics and the effect of taxes on the working class and how viewers of this film at that time felt about it. -Janis Shurtleff |
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| I think this movie is a call to action against the government. Ronald Reagan became president in 1980, and his administration was severely anti-union. This movie was an attempt to show the way the government was trying to once again stop people from unionizing, and how big business was taking over. | I think this movie is a call to action against the government. Ronald Reagan became president in 1980, and his administration was severely anti-union. This movie was an attempt to show the way the government was trying to once again stop people from unionizing, and how big business was taking over. |
| --Cat Kinde | --Cat Kinde |
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| I believe this movie shows a lot about the 1980s under Regan. Regan was particularly hard on unregulated unions. During Regan's presidency, there was an aircraft controller strike, they demanded higher wages and shorter hours. Regan upheld the idea that the companies must be respected by the workers. In “Matewan” Sayles takes the side of the Union workers, as he tries to emphasize the repressive actions of large companies against their workers. —Helen Dhue | I believe this movie shows a lot about the 1980s under Regan. Regan was particularly hard on unregulated unions. During Regan's presidency, there was an aircraft controller strike, they demanded higher wages and shorter hours. Regan upheld the idea that the companies must be respected by the workers. **In “Matewan” Sayles takes the side of the Union workers, as he tries to emphasize the repressive actions of large companies against their workers.** —Helen Dhue |
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| ===== V. The "So, what?" question ====== | ===== V. The "So, what?" question ====== |
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| //Matewan// is an interesting movie. It is arguably one of the most historically accurate of the films we have seen so far. However, it does revolve around two completely fictional characters, Joe Kenehan and Danny Radnor. This is somewhat disconcerting because they both represent well a certain view in labor history. Joe is a pacifist who wants the union to accept everyone, including blacks and immigrants, so that they can work together to achieve their objectives. Danny can be related to the individuals who shared their first hand experiences of this massacre, mainly because the film is told from his perspective. The fact that the film revolves around fictional characters is more than a little disappointing. Sayles did a good job at trying to be as accurate to the coal miner's plight as possible, yet used fictional characters intermingled with historical ones to do so. The film could have just as easily been told from the perspective of an actual historical figure. -- Lyndsey Clark | //Matewan// is an interesting movie. It is arguably one of the most historically accurate of the films we have seen so far. However, it does revolve around two completely fictional characters, Joe Kenehan and Danny Radnor. **This is somewhat disconcerting because they both represent well a certain view in labor history. Joe is a pacifist who wants the union to accept everyone, including blacks and immigrants, so that they can work together to achieve their objectives.** Danny can be related to the individuals who shared their first hand experiences of this massacre, mainly because the film is told from his perspective. The fact that the film revolves around fictional characters is more than a little disappointing. Sayles did a good job at trying to be as accurate to the coal miner's plight as possible, yet used fictional characters intermingled with historical ones to do so. The film could have just as easily been told from the perspective of an actual historical figure. -- Lyndsey Clark |
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| The film absolutely deserves commendation and praise for being wonderfully accurate to its sources, and deserves praise for its realism and dedication. However, I definitely think something needs to be said for the way this film was shot, and how it drags on for so unnecessarily long in certain places. The film, despite beingmade in 1989 feels like it is 20 years older, which is forgivable given the budget of the film, but far more entertaining films have been shot with a smaller budget. While the use of natural lighting is good in most scenes, this film in almost every scene is so dark, the sound design is not great and you definitely need subtitles to understand what is going on. To be perfectly honest, for once I with the directed had taken liberties or at least left scenes out for entertainment's sake, this is probably one of the most boring films we have seen so far, (besides Gone with the Wind, which is only more boring because of its abysmal runtime.) I do wish the director had shot scenes to be less bland, maybe shot scenes to be less dark, the film gets interesting and exciting for a few minutes but scenes that should be suspenseful, like when Few Clothes is going to kill Kehenan, end up feeling flat and boring and if you don't have subtitles on or pay very close attention, you have no idea what is supposed to be happening. This film is perfect for history students, would not recommend for a casual movie watcher, or anyone who doesn't already know the history behind it. One final point, the film ends when things begin, not when things end, the Matewan Massacre was the *beginning* of the Coalfield War, and led to the far bigger and more important Battle of Blair Mountain, which, along with Sid Hatfield's assassination, would have been a far more entertaining watch. The film just does not do enough to make you care about the characters, and does not even show how the Mayor or Kehenan gets shot. | The film absolutely deserves commendation and praise for being wonderfully accurate to its sources, and deserves praise for its realism and dedication. However, I definitely think something needs to be said for the way this film was shot, and how it drags on for so unnecessarily long in certain places. The film, despite being made in 1989 feels like it is 20 years older, which is forgivable given the budget of the film, but far more entertaining films have been shot with a smaller budget. While the use of natural lighting is good in most scenes, this film in almost every scene is so dark, the sound design is not great and you definitely need subtitles to understand what is going on. To be perfectly honest, for once I with the directed had taken liberties or at least left scenes out for entertainment's sake, this is probably one of the most boring films we have seen so far, (besides Gone with the Wind, which is only more boring because of its abysmal runtime.) I do wish the director had shot scenes to be less bland, maybe shot scenes to be less dark, the film gets interesting and exciting for a few minutes but scenes that should be suspenseful, like when Few Clothes is going to kill Kehenan, end up feeling flat and boring and if you don't have subtitles on or pay very close attention, you have no idea what is supposed to be happening. This film is perfect for history students, would not recommend for a casual movie watcher, or anyone who doesn't already know the history behind it. One final point, the film ends when things begin, not when things end, the Matewan Massacre was the *beginning* of the Coalfield War, and led to the far bigger and more important Battle of Blair Mountain, which, along with Sid Hatfield's assassination, would have been a far more entertaining watch. The film just does not do enough to make you care about the characters, and does not even show how the Mayor or Kehenan gets shot. |
| However this is all my opinion. Ultimately, the film is the example of historical accuracy affecting viewer interest in the film.--AJ DeGeorge | However this is all my opinion. **Ultimately, the film is the example of historical accuracy affecting viewer interest in the film**.--AJ DeGeorge |
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| //Matewan// is one of the best movies we have watched so far. It's importance lies in its attention to historical accuracy. It does what a true historical film does, bringing attention to an unfamiliar story and portraying it as accurately as possible. Although it has fictional characters, I don't think this really hurts the film in any way. Compared to other films, it does an exceptional job in being both accurate and entertaining, despite what others may say. This is a bit funny, because it contradicts what Mel Gibson said when making //The Patriot//. Films that focus primarily on historical accuracy aren't always snooze fests. -- Jordan Petty | //Matewan// is one of the best movies we have watched so far. It's importance lies in its attention to historical accuracy. It does what a true historical film does, bringing attention to an unfamiliar story and portraying it as accurately as possible. Although it has fictional characters, I don't think this really hurts the film in any way. Compared to other films, it does an exceptional job in being both accurate and entertaining, despite what others may say. This is a bit funny, because it contradicts what Mel Gibson said when making //The Patriot//. Films that focus primarily on historical accuracy aren't always snooze fests. -- Jordan Petty |
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| I think that this film is an important addition to the list of films we have watched this semester. The struggle of coal miners and building labor unions, specifically this story, is not something well known. I personally did not know this story or this movie until this class. I think even with some historical inaccuracies like extra or inaccurate characters, the movie still does a good job staying fairly true to the story and giving the viewers what they want without adding or subtracting the things that are usually altered for the sake of ratings. I think this movie does a good job of being entertaining without sacrificing facts and gives the characters personality's that make it hard to not be invested in them. Overall I think this film is well made and creates a good frame of reference for the story of the Matewan Massacre. --Kimberly Sak | I think that this film is an important addition to the list of films we have watched this semester. **The struggle of coal miners and building labor unions, specifically this story, is not something well known.** I personally did not know this story or this movie until this class. I think even with some historical inaccuracies like extra or inaccurate characters, the movie still does a good job staying fairly true to the story and giving the viewers what they want without adding or subtracting the things that are usually altered for the sake of ratings. I think this movie does a good job of being entertaining without sacrificing facts and gives the characters personality's that make it hard to not be invested in them. Overall I think this film is well made and creates a good frame of reference for the story of the Matewan Massacre. --Kimberly Sak |
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| This film stands out as //Matewan// actually tells the story of these miners and unions without overly-dramatizing or fictionalizing the story. There is a small amount of romance in the film that at least serves a purpose to move the narrative along and to demonstrate the damage that spies within a unionizing group could cause. This film is also important because it humanizes the unioning workers, something that often is not shown to people, particularly in America with "right to work states" and a view of unionizing as a socialist or communist construct to be feared. This film reminds Americans why these unions formed and the horrible working conditions and mistreatments they were fighting against and it's no coincidence that it came out in another period where people were protesting against unions in the 1980s after President Reagan's treatment of the Air Traffic Controllers. It makes an active effort to show the diverse cultures and conflicts in mining towns and to cover the radicalism, violence, and complexities of the early formation of labor unions. Ultimately it is a well-made film and I hope to use it or at least excerpts of it in my classroom to address the Matewan Massacre, the coal industry, and unions in the United States, and it contributes to the overall credibility of historical films. - Ashley Dimino | This film stands out as //Matewan// actually tells the story of these miners and unions without overly-dramatizing or fictionalizing the story. There is a small amount of romance in the film that at least serves a purpose to move the narrative along and to demonstrate the damage that spies within a unionizing group could cause. **This film is also important because it humanizes the unioning workers, something that often is not shown to people, particularly in America with "right to work states" and a view of unionizing as a socialist or communist construct to be feared.** This film reminds Americans why these unions formed and the horrible working conditions and mistreatments they were fighting against and it's no coincidence that it came out in another period where people were protesting against unions in the 1980s after President Reagan's treatment of the Air Traffic Controllers. It makes an active effort to show the diverse cultures and conflicts in mining towns and to cover the radicalism, violence, and complexities of the early formation of labor unions. Ultimately it is a well-made film and I hope to use it or at least excerpts of it in my classroom to address the Matewan Massacre, the coal industry, and unions in the United States, and it contributes to the overall credibility of historical films. - Ashley Dimino |
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| This film is important because it is about a relatively unknown portion of American history. People may know child labor existed, working conditions were bad, and there was corruption in this time period, but few people know the extent of any of these realities. The film tells a largely accurate version of each of these details in horrifying and brutal ways. The audience sees how crooked companies could be and still get away with their deeds. It is important for audiences to know these areas of history. Most movies focus on wars or other areas of history while few tell the story of events like the Matewan Massacre. As a result, this film is important, especially because it is fairly accurate. -Daniel Walker | This film is important because it is about a relatively unknown portion of American history. People may know child labor existed, working conditions were bad, and there was corruption in this time period, but few people know the extent of any of these realities. The film tells a largely accurate version of each of these details in horrifying and brutal ways. The audience sees how crooked companies could be and still get away with their deeds. It is important for audiences to know these areas of history. Most movies focus on wars or other areas of history while few tell the story of events like the Matewan Massacre. As a result, this film is important, especially because it is fairly accurate. -Daniel Walker |
| I think this is a pretty important topic when learning about American history so a movie that portrays it well is a great thing to see. Working class struggles in America aren't something people generally learn about, especially how radical some of the movements were. Thanks to unions we live much better lives than 100 years ago. The 8 hour work day, paid sick leave, minimum wage laws, and so much more is all taken for granted today but was fought so hard for back in the day, many times resulting in actual wars between workers and bosses. This is definitely a topic more Americans should be exposed to, the actual struggle for unionization, the long history of class divisions in America, and the power of the union are all still relevant topics today. - Wilson | I think this is a pretty important topic when learning about American history so a movie that portrays it well is a great thing to see. Working class struggles in America aren't something people generally learn about, especially how radical some of the movements were. Thanks to unions we live much better lives than 100 years ago. The 8 hour work day, paid sick leave, minimum wage laws, and so much more is all taken for granted today but was fought so hard for back in the day, many times resulting in actual wars between workers and bosses. This is definitely a topic more Americans should be exposed to, the actual struggle for unionization, the long history of class divisions in America, and the power of the union are all still relevant topics today. - Wilson |
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| I feel like the topic of workers struggles is largely overlooked in schools. When I was younger I remember probably learning about a couple strikes and then ending with the conclusion that people like the Pinkertons and Baldwin-Felts were just badass detectives. Organized labor is still an important topic today and in 2018 Union membership hit a record low here in the U.S. I believe there is a chance that this may change as we are headed into a different era politically in the U.S. Many ideals that died with FDR and were destroyed by the Cold War are making a resurgence. - Dan Dilks | I feel like the topic of workers struggles is largely overlooked in schools. When I was younger I remember probably learning about a couple strikes and then ending with the conclusion that people like the Pinkertons and Baldwin-Felts were just badass detectives.** Organized labor is still an important topic today and in 2018 Union membership hit a record low here in the U.S.** I believe there is a chance that this may change as we are headed into a different era politically in the U.S. Many ideals that died with FDR and were destroyed by the Cold War are making a resurgence. - Dan Dilks |
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| I feel like this film at least attempts to give a voice to truly communities in rural Appalachia, by simply putting mountain communities on screen It tries- albeit very imperfectly- to portray applicable folks in this part of the country as intelligent and autonomous, if if they are without a formal education. They are not saved by a well-educated high-brow flatfoot, as is the case with many movies about rural America. As a matter of fact, they weren't "rescued" at all. Even today, poorer folks in what many in cities have referred to as "flyover country" are forgotten or abused by Richmond, Charleston, and Washington, and yet they move on and embrace their work. | I feel like this film at least attempts to give a voice to truly communities in rural Appalachia, by simply putting mountain communities on screen It tries- albeit very imperfectly- to portray applicable folks in this part of the country as intelligent and autonomous, if if they are without a formal education. They are not saved by a well-educated high-brow flatfoot, as is the case with many movies about rural America. As a matter of fact, they weren't "rescued" at all. Even today, poorer folks in what many in cities have referred to as "flyover country" are forgotten or abused by Richmond, Charleston, and Washington, and yet they move on and embrace their work. |
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| Occasionally, a few will even save up some money to help their children grandchildren get a secondary education head off to college, grateful for the time their family labored in mills, mines, or tobacco fields. Then, we get to hear college people wax eloquent about their intellectual superiority to our friends and family who are just uneducated hicks who don't really know what's good for their own communities. True story. (Not referring to anyone, don't worry.) -Ethan | Occasionally, a few will even save up some money to help their children grandchildren get a secondary education head off to college, grateful for the time their family labored in mills, mines, or tobacco fields. Then, we get to hear college people wax eloquent about their intellectual superiority to our friends and family who are just uneducated hicks who don't really know what's good for their own communities. True story. (Not referring to anyone in this class, don't worry.) -Ethan |
