Differences

This shows you the differences between two versions of the page.

--- 329:question:329--week_10_questions_comments-2020 [2020/10/29 11:26] – [I.How does this movie work as a secondary source? What does the movie get right about history?] 73.40.104.245
+++ 329:question:329--week_10_questions_comments-2020 [2020/10/29 13:01] (current) – [V. The "So, what?" question] 73.40.104.245
@@ Line 4: / Line 4: @@
 ====== I.	How does this movie work as a secondary source? What does the movie get right about history?  ======
-The movie, //Matewan//, is one of the most historically accurate movies that we have discussed so far in class. This movie recounts the events that took place with the 1920s coal miner's strike in Mingo County, West Virginia, which results in a bloody encounter between the miners and the coal company's security force on the main street in Matewan, West Virginia. Race and ethnicity were also very apparent throughout the entire movie. The role played by each of these major issues during the 1920s is crucial to understanding the history of the American working class in the post-World War II era. There were streams of immigrants and migrants coming into this rural area that had already been inhabited by a certain group of people for generations. The cultural differences that the Italian Americans, the African Americans arriving from rural Alabama, and the longtime resident Appalachian white people are all unique in their own way, and these groups try to work as a cohesive unit but it doesn't always work. All of these ethnic groups are manipulated by the mine operators that seek to maintain rigid control over the workforce. These shared experiences of forming and being apart of a labor union will ultimately reunite them as a single labor union regardless of color or background.
+The movie, //Matewan//, is one of the most historically accurate movies that we have discussed so far in class. This movie recounts the events that took place with the 1920s coal miner's strike in Mingo County, West Virginia, which results in a bloody encounter between the miners and the coal company's security force on the main street in Matewan, West Virginia. **Race and ethnicity were also very apparent throughout the entire movie.** The role played by each of these major issues during the 1920s is crucial to understanding the history of the American working class in the post-World War II era. There were streams of immigrants and migrants coming into this rural area that had already been inhabited by a certain group of people for generations. The cultural differences that the Italian Americans, the African Americans arriving from rural Alabama, and the longtime resident Appalachian white people are all unique in their own way, and these groups try to work as a cohesive unit but it doesn't always work. **All of these ethnic groups are manipulated by the mine operators that seek to maintain rigid control over the workforce. These shared experiences of forming and being apart of a labor union will ultimately reunite them as a single labor union regardless of color or background.
+**
 Zappia, Charles. "Labor, Race, and Ethnicity in the West Virginia Mines: //Matewan//". Summer 2011. https://www.jstor.org/stable/pdf/10.5406/jamerethnhist.30.4.0044.pdf?refreqid=excelsior%3A07e772bedf7ed4e98c3fd410ebeab92b -Lauren Simpson
-This week's movie, Matewan is probably the most historically accurate movie we have watched so far. This movie follows the real story of the miners in West Virginia. One way this movie could be seen and used as a secondary source is how the timeline of the movie follows the real story and accounts of the battle between the union and the miners. This movie uses real-life people to base the characters on, despite adding in a few additional fictional ones. As we know, with some of the other movies we have watched, the directors add in additional plots or romances that capture the attention of the viewers. But, this movie does not really have a “side plot” which allows for the real story of the miners to shine through on the screen. - Kaylee Williams
+This week's movie, Matewan is probably the most historically accurate movie we have watched so far. This movie follows the real story of the miners in West Virginia. **One way this movie could be seen and used as a secondary source is how the timeline of the movie follows the real story and accounts of the battle between the union and the miners.** This movie uses real-life people to base the characters on, despite adding in a few additional fictional ones. As we know, with some of the other movies we have watched, the directors add in additional plots or romances that capture the attention of the viewers. But, this movie does not really have a “side plot” which allows for the real story of the miners to shine through on the screen. - Kaylee Williams
-This film was incredibly accurate to the historical source material, and was probably one of the most accurate we have seen up until this point. The period and location accurate clothes, weapons, characters, groups and themes were all done extremely well, and if someone were to use this film as a secondary source, they could use it the same way they could use a secondary source book about the subject. The actual confrontation is not overly dramatized or longer, and felt like it could have been a real shootout.-- Antonio DeGeorge
+This film was incredibly accurate to the historical source material, and was probably one of the most accurate we have seen up until this point. **The period and location accurate clothes, weapons, characters, groups and themes were all done extremely well,** and if someone were to use this film as a secondary source, they could use it the same way they could use a secondary source book about the subject. The actual confrontation is not overly dramatized or longer, and felt like it could have been a real shootout.-- Antonio DeGeorge
-The film, //Matewan// is a very historically accurate film. I enjoyed learning about the mines in West Virginia, since I had no prior knowledge on it. The film is a great secondary source especially for people like myself who don't have any background in it. Most of the characters are actual people and the actual confrontation is accurate. I enjoyed getting a sense of understanding for the labor problems and race in the West Virginia mines. The miners allow us to get an understanding of the frustrations of the time as well. Overall, this film is an excellent secondary source, unlike many other films we have seen. --Tara Scroggins
+The film, //Matewan// is a very historically accurate film. I enjoyed learning about the mines in West Virginia, since I had no prior knowledge on it. The film is a great secondary source especially for people like myself who don't have any background in it. **Most of the characters are actual people and the actual confrontation is accurate.** I enjoyed getting a sense of understanding for the labor problems and race in the West Virginia mines. The miners allow us to get an understanding of the frustrations of the time as well. Overall, this film is an excellent secondary source, unlike many other films we have seen. --Tara Scroggins
-Compared to the other movies we have watched, this film is probably the most accurate. It's at the very least on the same level as //Glory//. It takes an event that isn't well discussed in classrooms or textbooks and portrays it to a public audience in an honest way. For being a film that can be used as a secondary source, //Matewan// does exactly what it needs to do, or at least does as much as it needs to. One aspect that is portrayed quite well is race relations in early 20th century America. What I find interesting about this film, what I think truly separates it from the others we have watched is that it seems to actually sacrifice entertainment for accuracy. Most historically-based films take a lot of liberties in order to engage public audiences, but //Matewan// seems to do the opposite, which kind of relates to what Mel Gibson said when making //The Patriot//. The film is somewhat hard to follow at times because it deals with a relatively unfamiliar event and the pace is not very fast, but for audiences actually interested in history would find the film fascinating. For me, it was a nice change of pace. -- Jordan Petty
+Compared to the other movies we have watched, this film is probably the most accurate. It's at the very least on the same level as //Glory//. It takes an event that isn't well discussed in classrooms or textbooks and portrays it to a public audience in an honest way. For being a film that can be used as a secondary source, //Matewan// does exactly what it needs to do, or at least does as much as it needs to. One aspect that is portrayed quite well is race relations in early 20th century America.** What I find interesting about this film, what I think truly separates it from the others we have watched is that it seems to actually sacrifice entertainment for accuracy.** Most historically-based films take a lot of liberties in order to engage public audiences, but //Matewan// seems to do the opposite, which kind of relates to what Mel Gibson said when making //The Patriot//. The film is somewhat hard to follow at times because it deals with a relatively unfamiliar event and the pace is not very fast, but for audiences actually interested in history would find the film fascinating. For me, it was a nice change of pace. -- Jordan Petty
-This movie gets a number of details correct about the Matewan massacre.  In the film, the miners are paid in company scrip that can only be used at the company stores.  The preacher is an example of how child labor still went on in the coal mines in West Virginia.  The chief of police and mayor were both offered bribes but declined them.  The chief of police also refused to allow the company to evict people who were on strike.  Beyond factual details, the film also does a good job of capturing the setting.  The music, accents, shops and buildings all help create an authentic feeling of a coal mining town in West Virginia during the 1920s.-Daniel Walker
+This movie gets a number of details correct about the Matewan massacre.  **In the film, the miners are paid in company scrip that can only be used at the company stores.  The preacher is an example of how child labor still went on in the coal mines in West Virginia. ** The chief of police and mayor were both offered bribes but declined them.  The chief of police also refused to allow the company to evict people who were on strike.  Beyond factual details, the film also does a good job of capturing the setting.  The music, accents, shops and buildings all help create an authentic feeling of a coal mining town in West Virginia during the 1920s.-Daniel Walker
-In my opinion, the film Matewan is a very historically accurate film making it a good secondary source. This film does a good job of showing the 1920 strike in the coal mines of southern West Virginia that leads to the Matewan Massacre. I think that this film coupled with a lesson on labor unions during this time period would be good for both high school and college students. If someone were to watch this film by itself I feel as if it would be confusing and they would have no idea what was going on. Having some background knowledge about labor unions, such as the United Mine Workers of America would be useful when seeing how the different races of coal miners interact in this film. During the time period of this movie labor unions were more inclusive and showing the inclusivity of race in labor groups allows for viewers to understand that the possibility of interracial cooperation with African Americans and immigrants was important. Another thing that this film does a good job of showing us just how bad the higher-ups in the coal industry were and how bad labor union detective agencies were especially the Baldwin-Felts Detective Agency. -Megan Williams
+In my opinion, the film Matewan is a very historically accurate film making it a good secondary source. This film does a good job of showing the 1920 strike in the coal mines of southern West Virginia that leads to the Matewan Massacre. I think that this film coupled with a lesson on labor unions during this time period would be good for both high school and college students. If someone were to watch this film by itself I feel as if it would be confusing and they would have no idea what was going on. Having some background knowledge about labor unions, such as the United Mine Workers of America would be useful when seeing how the different races of coal miners interact in this film. During the time period of this movie labor unions were more inclusive and showing the inclusivity of race in labor groups allows for viewers to understand that the possibility of interracial cooperation with African Americans and immigrants was important.** Another thing that this film does a good job of showing us just how bad the higher-ups in the coal industry were and how bad labor union detective agencies were especially the Baldwin-Felts Detective Agency.** -Megan Williams
-I think this movie works fairly well as a secondary source for the story. Any added characters or side storylines aside, the movie does a pretty good job of keeping to the events of the actual history and even, as far as I can tell, staying pretty close to the timeline of the events, something that a lot of past movies have struggled with. It does a good job of showing the strike and the environments and rules that the miners lived and worked in and the responses of the company to the changing attitude in their mines. I think the movie could be watched by itself to hear the story of the Matewan Massacre, however I think that someone who is out to learn about it would benefit from side research, more about unions and relationships would be beneficial. Having a bit of that background knowledge I think the movie does good sticking to the events and does a good job of showing some of the characters such as the miners, the "scabs" and the Baldwin-Felts agents as well. Overall this would make a great secondary source for someone out to learn about the Matewan Massacre and the labor union development in coal mines in West Virginia. --Kimberly Sak
+I think this movie works fairly well as a secondary source for the story. Any added characters or side storylines aside, the movie does a pretty good job of keeping to the events of the actual history and even, as far as I can tell, staying pretty close to the timeline of the events, something that a lot of past movies have struggled with.** It does a good job of showing the strike and the environments and rules that the miners lived and worked in and the responses of the company to the changing attitude in their mines.** I think the movie could be watched by itself to hear the story of the Matewan Massacre, however I think that someone who is out to learn about it would benefit from side research, more about unions and relationships would be beneficial. Having a bit of that background knowledge I think the movie does good sticking to the events and does a good job of showing some of the characters such as the miners, the "scabs" and the Baldwin-Felts agents as well. Overall this would make a great secondary source for someone out to learn about the Matewan Massacre and the labor union development in coal mines in West Virginia. --Kimberly Sak
-I think this movie is a very good secondary source, for both the event depicted and the overall labor movement in this time period. The attitudes towards the 'scabs' as well as towards the union itself followed closely what we discussed in class on Tuesday and in the readings for Thursday. Even though the two 'main' characters are fictionalized, several others weren't, such as Sid Hatfield. The struggles of a coal town that is entirely built around the coal mining company are shown, with the main example being the eviction of the miners from their 'company housing'. I'm glad that I went into this movie having the background from the lecture and readings, but even if I was just watching it in theaters I think it still would have been an accurate introduction into the labor movements at the turn of the century. —Madison Roberts
+I think this movie is a very good secondary source, for both the event depicted and the overall labor movement in this time period. **The attitudes towards the 'scabs' as well as towards the union itself followed closely what we discussed in class on Tuesday and in the readings for Thursday.** Even though the two 'main' characters are fictionalized, several others weren't, such as Sid Hatfield. **The struggles of a coal town that is entirely built around the coal mining company are shown, with the main example being the eviction of the miners from their 'company housing'.** I'm glad that I went into this movie having the background from the lecture and readings, but even if I was just watching it in theaters I think it still would have been an accurate introduction into the labor movements at the turn of the century. —Madison Roberts
-//Matewan// was overall a very impressive film and one of the more historically accurate films that we have seen. It actually shows the diversity of the miners in the film and the conflicts, language barriers, and efforts at working together to prevent the company from dividing them as companies often sought to do to unionizing workers. In addition, it seems to depict the horrible mining conditions well, and how important it was to the economy in West Virginia and the Appalachian region. It showed the dependence on the mining companies that employment contracts created including having to shop at the company store only, living in company houses, and "rental fees" for the equipment they were using. Additionally, the film accurately portrays the use of the Baldwin-Felts agency and the violent conflicts between the miners and the agents and company in the Matewan strike. This serves as a very effective secondary source to look at the history of unions in the United States and in particular in the mining industry in Appalachia and the Matewan Massacre. -Ashley Dimino
+//Matewan// was overall a very impressive film and one of the more historically accurate films that we have seen. It actually shows the diversity of the miners in the film and the conflicts, language barriers, and efforts at working together to prevent the company from dividing them as companies often sought to do to unionizing workers. In addition, it seems to depict the horrible mining conditions well, and how important it was to the economy in West Virginia and the Appalachian region. **It showed the dependence on the mining companies that employment contracts created including having to shop at the company store only, living in company houses, and "rental fees" for the equipment they were using. Additionally, the film accurately portrays the use of the Baldwin-Felts agency and the violent conflicts between the miners and the agents and company in the Matewan strike.** This serves as a very effective secondary source to look at the history of unions in the United States and in particular in the mining industry in Appalachia and the Matewan Massacre. -Ashley Dimino
-The film Matewan is a film that is enough to be a good introduction to the topics of coal miners and their fight for better treatment in West Virginia in the early 20th century. It is not a film that could be used as a source but could be used to enhance a discussion of such topics as the fight for worker rights and treatment. The film includes characters who were a part of the historical event of which it is based. The sheriff Sid Hatfield and the mayor Cabell Testerman who refused to take a bribe and sided with the town over the coal company. Even the eventual death of the sheriff Sid Hatfield on the steps of the courthouse was accurate. Few clothes Johnson and the joining of the African American strike breakers with the town’s workers in the strike. The intermingling of workers into an interracial union was a miniature version of what was happening with some of the unions as they allowed most workers of different origins to join and fight the oppression of the companies. The presence of the Baldwin Felts detective agency agents throughout the film seem to be drawn from the historical record as they operate with violence and power but back down when they no longer have the upper hand. There violent nature and unlawful presence as a goon squad serves the purpose for which they were historically deployed as the guns of the company to quell the strike by spreading fear. The end massacre at the train station was rather good in terms of accuracy of a gunfight and in terms of the historical record. The fight claims the mayor, Baldwin Felts agents, and workers with a handful dead on the scene and the resulting war between workers and companies being of a greater bloodbath according to the end voice over. A final thought is the cruel grim realty of the mines with the grime, fear, and harsh work. The abusive use of company script that could only be used in the company store for prices controlled by the company. The reality that the company owned the housing, furniture, and amenities and they charged their workers for the use of the poor-quality company owned supplies. The workers and their families were aware of events like cave ins in which the trapped miners slowly died and left their loved ones behind as was clear in the reading of their letters that showed how they accepted the reality and were sorry to depart early. Overall, the film presents many points and ideas that seem to be drawn from the historical record even if it adds its own characters and drama. -Robert Keitz
+The film Matewan is a film that is enough to be a good introduction to the topics of coal miners and their fight for better treatment in West Virginia in the early 20th century. It is not a film that could be used as a source but could be used to enhance a discussion of such topics as the fight for worker rights and treatment. The film includes characters who were a part of the historical event of which it is based. **The sheriff Sid Hatfield and the mayor Cabell Testerman who refused to take a bribe and sided with the town over the coal company.** Even the eventual death of the sheriff Sid Hatfield on the steps of the courthouse was accurate. Few clothes Johnson and the joining of the African American strike breakers with the town’s workers in the strike. The intermingling of workers into an interracial union was a miniature version of what was happening with some of the unions as they allowed most workers of different origins to join and fight the oppression of the companies. **The presence of the Baldwin Felts detective agency agents throughout the film seem to be drawn from the historical record as they operate with violence and power but back down when they no longer have the upper hand.** There violent nature and unlawful presence as a goon squad serves the purpose for which they were historically deployed as the guns of the company to quell the strike by spreading fear. The end massacre at the train station was rather good in terms of accuracy of a gunfight and in terms of the historical record. The fight claims the mayor, Baldwin Felts agents, and workers with a handful dead on the scene and the resulting war between workers and companies being of a greater bloodbath according to the end voice over. A final thought is the cruel grim realty of the mines with the grime, fear, and harsh work. The abusive use of company script that could only be used in the company store for prices controlled by the company.** The reality that the company owned the housing, furniture, and amenities and they charged their workers for the use of the poor-quality company owned supplies.** The workers and their families were aware of events like cave ins in which the trapped miners slowly died and left their loved ones behind as was clear in the reading of their letters that showed how they accepted the reality and were sorry to depart early. Overall, the film presents many points and ideas that seem to be drawn from the historical record even if it adds its own characters and drama. -Robert Keitz
-Besides what we learned about in class on Tuesday, I have no previous background with this history. However, based off that lecture, I would say that Matewan is fairly accurate to the time period. The depiction of how the coal miners were treated, the way the spy for the company creates havoc among the miners, and how the miners were almost forced from their homes is all historically accurate to what was actually going on. If anything, this movie shows how wrong My Darling Clementine was, in that you do not need to rewrite history to make an interesting, and pretty historically accurate, film. --Cat Kinde
+Besides what we learned about in class on Tuesday, I have no previous background with this history. However, based off that lecture, I would say that Matewan is fairly accurate to the time period. The depiction of how the coal miners were treated,** the way the spy for the company creates havoc among the miners,** and how the miners were almost forced from their homes is all historically accurate to what was actually going on. If anything, this movie shows how wrong My Darling Clementine was, in that you do not need to rewrite history to make an interesting, and pretty historically accurate, film. --Cat Kinde
 I thought //Matewan// did an excellent job at representing the time period and the creating an overall accurate depiction of the struggle of coal miners in Appalachia. Just like the guy from the UMWA recording said, people noawadys don't realize what life was like before unions, and this movie shows those struggles that working people had to overcome to start unions. There were a lot of small details that the filmmakers included which made for an accurate and interesting movie. For example Kenehan explains why he didn't fight in WW1 because he viewed it as working people on both sides fighting for the interests of wealthy warmongers, and the fact he was jailed for it. Also the race relations between white miners and black and Italian scabs who were resented for taking all the jobs. Later, Kenehan, an IWW member, united everyone under the same cause which was one of the goals of the wobblies. From the readings, I also think the portrayal of the company store was pretty accurate. Workers were paid in script that could only be redeemed at the store which made workers reliant on the bosses for everything, which often meant bosses would cheat miners out of their earnings. - Wilson L
-Matewan was pretty accurate to the story. Matewan exposed how young many of the coal miners were, some of the characters being in their early teens. The movie also did a good job of showing how much power the coal companies had over the town, controlling housing, and the livelihoods of the people in the town since pretty much everyone worked for the mine there. As well, the movie did a good job of showing the racial tension that existed between the workers and that although they united together, things were still not perfect. —Helen Dhue
+Matewan was pretty accurate to the story. **Matewan exposed how young many of the coal miners were, some of the characters being in their early teens.** The movie also did a good job of showing how much power the coal companies had over the town, controlling housing, and the livelihoods of the people in the town since pretty much everyone worked for the mine there. As well, the movie did a good job of showing the racial tension that existed between the workers and that although they united together, things were still not perfect. —Helen Dhue
-The movie //Matewan// works very well as a secondary source. It was another very accurate depiction of the historical event and was a very good depiction of the primary source documents we read. I think that this movie would be a great introduction to the life and story of those West Virginian coal miners for someone who was unfamiliar. It explained many different aspects of what life was like living and working in a company town, the physical effects that working in a coal mine had, and the work that the miners put into creating a union that would support them. The film did a good job of portraying both the workers and the company owners. -Mariah Morton
+The movie //Matewan// works very well as a secondary source. It was another very accurate depiction of the historical event and was a very good depiction of the primary source documents we read. I think that this movie would be a great introduction to the life and story of those West Virginian coal miners for someone who was unfamiliar. **It explained many different aspects of what life was like living and working in a company town, the physical effects that working in a coal mine had, and the work that the miners put into creating a union that would support them.** The film did a good job of portraying both the workers and the company owners. -Mariah Morton
-I think that Matewan works well as a secondary source as long as one realizes that the story is largely told and pushed along by fictional characters. I think the movie did a good job at portraying how life was for those living in company towns. One of the opening shots in town shows the company store and when the scabs were being given their instructions they even had to take the cost of shovels and pick axes out of their pay. There was even the scene with the Baldwin-Felts men going to the union camp and trying to confiscate everything saying it belonged to the company. The grip that the company had over these people is intense. In one article I found from the Smithsonian a former coal miner stated, "If you got a mule killed in the mines and you were in charge you could lose your job over it. If you got a man killed he could be replaced". This sentiment was echoed throughout the film. - Dan Dilks
+I think that Matewan works well as a secondary source as long as one realizes that the story is largely told and pushed along by fictional characters. I think the movie did a good job at portraying how life was for those living in company towns. One of the opening shots in town shows the company store and when the scabs were being given their instructions they even had to take the cost of shovels and pick axes out of their pay. **There was even the scene with the Baldwin-Felts men going to the union camp and trying to confiscate everything saying it belonged to the company. The grip that the company had over these people is intense.** In one article I found from the Smithsonian a former coal miner stated, "If you got a mule killed in the mines and you were in charge you could lose your job over it. If you got a man killed he could be replaced". This sentiment was echoed throughout the film. - Dan Dilks
 https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/forgotten-matewan-massacre-was-epicenter-20th-century-mine-wars-180963026/ -Dan Dilks
-I honestly thought that one of the -if not the- best parts of the movie was the fact that it showed the central role that music played and still plays in the life of Appalachians. Music is everywhere in the the film: sorrow, joy, faith, and even interracial conversation are expressed in QUITE well-done folk music.
+I honestly thought that one of the -if not the- **best parts of the movie was the fact that it showed the central role that music played and still plays in the life of Appalachians.** Music is everywhere in the the film: sorrow, joy, faith, and even interracial conversation are expressed in QUITE well-done folk music.
 Also, its awesome (and sad) to finally see the coal wars portrayed in film.
-Also, as a secondary note, if you changed the clothing at bit, this is still what my part of the country is like today: I'm a bit biased, but the spirit of modern Appalachia is also very present in the film: hard work that folks proudly owns and forceful defense of one's community (the "hand of the law" still often can't reach out here) are still very present here.
+Also, as a secondary note, if you changed the clothing at bit, this is still what my part of the country is like today: I'm a bit biased, **but the spirit of modern Appalachia is also very present in the film:** hard work that folks proudly owns and forceful defense of one's community (the "hand of the law" still often can't reach out here) are still very present here.
 -Ethan (writing from his family's home in the mountains)
@@ Line 55: / Line 55: @@
-Although //Matewan// is overall historically accurate, there are a few inaccuracies throughout the movie. The story itself revolves around two completely fictional characters, Joe Kenehan and Danny Radnor. The director, John Sayles, based Joe's character as an ardent pacifist that was sent in by the United Mine Workers of America in order to focus on the question of social justice and whether that can be achieved without violence. This is especially shown by when those that are in power rarely shy away from using violence and the area for the struggle is isolated and there is a concern for the larger society. He is the embodiment of a true union supporter that wanted the union to accept blacks, immigrants, etc. so they can all work together to achieve their objective. Danny narrates the film as an old man meaning that he was a survivor of the Matewan Massacre. Danny looks back at his younger self throughout the entire movie, while that young self watches Joe organizes the miners into a union and oppose the company that owns the coal town. This unique portrayal of his character allows for building a kind of quiet, understated heroism into the film's structure. -Lauren Simpson
+Although //Matewan// is overall historically accurate, there are a few inaccuracies throughout the movie. The story itself revolves around two completely fictional characters, Joe Kenehan and Danny Radnor. **The director, John Sayles, based Joe's character as an ardent pacifist that was sent in by the United Mine Workers of America in order to focus on the question of social justice and whether that can be achieved without violence.** This is especially shown by when those that are in power rarely shy away from using violence and the area for the struggle is isolated and there is a concern for the larger society. He is the embodiment of a true union supporter that wanted the union to accept blacks, immigrants, etc. so they can all work together to achieve their objective. Danny narrates the film as an old man meaning that he was a survivor of the Matewan Massacre. Danny looks back at his younger self throughout the entire movie, while that young self watches Joe organizes the miners into a union and oppose the company that owns the coal town. This unique portrayal of his character allows for building a kind of quiet, understated heroism into the film's structure. -Lauren Simpson
-//Matewan// is generally an accurate film, though there are a few errors in fact. I did some research on the people that are in the movie. The main character, Joe Kenehan is not a real person from the massacre. He plays a World War I veteran and a former member of the group, the Industrial Workers of the World. I think it was an interesting choice to have the main character be fictional, though I think the director does this to further the story and fill in any missing information that the real events lacked. There were a few more fictional characters, though this one is the most interesting to me. -- Tara Scroggins
+//Matewan// is generally an accurate film, though there are a few errors in fact. I did some research on the people that are in the movie. **The main character, Joe Kenehan is not a real person from the massacre.** He plays a World War I veteran and a former member of the group, the Industrial Workers of the World. I think it was an interesting choice to have the main character be fictional, though I think the director does this to further the story and fill in any missing information that the real events lacked. There were a few more fictional characters, though this one is the most interesting to me. -- Tara Scroggins
-Although //Matewan// is undoubtedly one of the most accurate films made, it is still a film, meaning it is not completely accurate. Like any director to a historical film, Sayles takes some liberties. The biggest being his usage of fictional characters. The film's main focus comes from Joe Kenehan and Danny Radnor, both didn't exist. However, I think in a way this helps the film. Like with the film //Glory//, the usage of fictional characters does not really hurt the film, because although these specific characters didn't exist, they represent the type of people that did exist in the actual story.
+Although //Matewan// is undoubtedly one of the most accurate films made, it is still a film, meaning it is not completely accurate. Like any director to a historical film, Sayles takes some liberties. **The biggest being his usage of fictional characters. The film's main focus comes from Joe Kenehan and Danny Radnor, both didn't exist.** However, I think in a way this helps the film. Like with the film //Glory//, the usage of fictional characters does not really hurt the film, because although these specific characters didn't exist, they represent the type of people that did exist in the actual story.
 In terms of inaccuracies, something else I noticed that didn't seem right was the emphasis they placed on Kenehan's character. The film made it seem like he was at the center of the conflict, but the conflict did not start or end with him. It also made the incident seem highly localized to Mingo County, but it had ramifications on American unionization in general.
@@ Line 65: / Line 65: @@
 Foner, Eric. “Historian Eric Foner on John Sayles’ MATEWAN .” Accessed October 28, 2020. http://films42.com/feature/november_feature.asp. -- Jordan Petty
-As others have already pointed out, the main character, Jor Kenehan was a fictionalized character.  This is a bit problematic because he was the main protagonist.  As a result, he changes the narrative of the true historical events.  Additionally, there is the whole plotline surrounding him being an imposter or a spy.  Given that he was not even a real character, it means that a good portion of the film was centered around a false event.  While it may have been likely for people to be suspicious of spies because companies did in fact use them, I still think it takes away from the plot because he was a fictional character.  Additionally, I think race relations were idealized in the movie. The United Mine Workers of America was an inclusive union, however, it is unlikely that the miners would have changed any prejudices that they had about African-Americans as quickly as they did in the movie.  This portrayal instills a false, idealized perception of race relations in this time period. -Daniel Walker
+As others have already pointed out, the main character, Jor Kenehan was a fictionalized character.  This is a bit problematic because he was the main protagonist.  As a result, he changes the narrative of the true historical events.  Additionally, there is the whole plotline surrounding him being an imposter or a spy.  Given that he was not even a real character, it means that a good portion of the film was centered around a false event.  While it may have been likely for people to be suspicious of spies because companies did in fact use them, I still think it takes away from the plot because he was a fictional character.  Additionally, I think race relations were idealized in the movie. **The United Mine Workers of America was an inclusive union, however, it is unlikely that the miners would have changed any prejudices that they had about African-Americans as quickly as they did in the movie.**  This portrayal instills a false, idealized perception of race relations in this time period. -Daniel Walker
 Like others have mentioned earlier this movie has two fictional characters “to propel the plot.” These characters as Jordan indices were Danny Radnor and Joe Kenehan. In Jordan’s post, he says that these two characters help the film, however, in my opinion, I feel as if this movie could have been written without them. The reason I feel this way is because putting emphasis on them takes away from the real people involved in the strike and the Matewan Massacre. -Megan Williams
-The film does not deviate from the historical record that much in its runtime. The union man Joe Kenehan seemed a bit too perfect and presented the unions as this perfect distant ideal. I think the film takes the side of the workers while only presenting the company as an unseen force which presents its hired goons to do its command and spread fear in its name. The film also does not include Mary “Mother” Jones despite her importance in the West Virginia labor organization in the time in which the massacre occurred. Tension is presented throughout the film but seems to dilute some of the tensions which would have been between the workers as their lives seem to be so much better at the makeshift camp. The ideals of the working class are too noble and perfect in the film as Joe and his words are a bit too perfect. -Robert Keitz
+The film does not deviate from the historical record that much in its runtime. The union man Joe Kenehan seemed a bit too perfect and presented the unions as this perfect distant ideal. I think the film takes the side of the workers while only presenting the company as an unseen force which presents its hired goons to do its command and spread fear in its name. **The film also does not include Mary “Mother” Jones despite her importance in the West Virginia labor organization in the time in which the massacre occurred.** Tension is presented throughout the film but seems to dilute some of the tensions which would have been between the workers as their lives seem to be so much better at the makeshift camp. The ideals of the working class are too noble and perfect in the film as Joe and his words are a bit too perfect. -Robert Keitz
 The film has heroes and villains, taking the side of the workers, however, workers were very oppressed by the companies so perhaps this was pretty accurate. Although the movie did a good job of presenting the history, as others have mentioned, the characters Danny Radnor and Joe Kenehan were fictionalized. However, I thought Danny Radnor added to the time period because of his young age and that many miners were under 18. — Helen Dhue
@@ Line 82: / Line 82: @@
 The movie did not seem to have too many obvious misconceptions surrounding the story of Matewan. I think that the film was one of the most true-to-fact films of the semester so far. It told the story of the coal miners, their struggle with organizing the union, and the massacre that they experienced with company men versus miners. It also did a good job of explaining what happened after the film ended, and how things ended up. -Mariah Morton
-According to some of the readings, the scrip system set up by companies often broke down and exploited the supply and demand chain in these areas. People couldn't buy anything from outside producers because they didn't have money, and trade didn't really work bc company stores didn't accept cash or checks. This was a very exploitative system that was slightly mentioned in the movie when the company tried to repossess all items purchased from the company store but it wasn't properly explored.  -Purnaja Podduturi
+According to some of the readings, the scrip system set up by companies often broke down and exploited the supply and demand chain in these areas. People couldn't buy anything from outside producers because they didn't have money, and trade didn't really work bc company stores didn't accept cash or checks. **This was a very exploitative system that was subtly explored in the way the company controlled all items and property and charged the people for every little thing.**  -Purnaja Podduturi
 ====== IV.	How does this movie work as a primary source about the time period in which it was made or the filmmakers? ======
-//Matewan// was released in 1987, six years after the PATCO strike in 1981 (source: https://www.npr.org/2006/08/03/5604656/1981-strike-leaves-legacy-for-american-workers). On August 3, 1981, the Professional Air Traffic Controllers Organization (PATCO) union, which had supported Ronald Reagan in the presidential election, rejected the government's pay raise offer. They sent 16,000 members out on strike to shut down commercial airlines. They also demanded a reduction in the workweek, from 40 to 32 hours, 40% pay raises, early retirement, and a $10,000 bonus. Due to federal law, such strikes were illegal. The strikers were given 48 hours to return to work, or else they would be fired and banned from ever again working in a federal capacity. One fourth of the strikers came back to work, but the rest did not and were fired.The strike collapsed. PATCO vanished in the aftermath, and the union movement as a whole suffered. It was a step backwards that accelerated the decline of membership across the board in the private sector. Afterwards, unions as a whole suffered a continual decline of power during the Reagan administration.Reagan himself had been a supporter of unions, but this event made him unpopular in their circles. It is possible that this event, which was a major loss to the Labor Movement, prompted a revival of its significance in the form of this film. -- Lyndsey Clark
+//Matewan// was released in 1987, six years after the PATCO strike in 1981 (source: https://www.npr.org/2006/08/03/5604656/1981-strike-leaves-legacy-for-american-workers). On August 3, 1981, the Professional Air Traffic Controllers Organization (PATCO) union, which had supported Ronald Reagan in the presidential election, rejected the government's pay raise offer. They sent 16,000 members out on strike to shut down commercial airlines. They also demanded a reduction in the workweek, from 40 to 32 hours, 40% pay raises, early retirement, and a $10,000 bonus. Due to federal law, such strikes were illegal. The strikers were given 48 hours to return to work, or else they would be fired and banned from ever again working in a federal capacity. One fourth of the strikers came back to work, but the rest did not and were fired.The strike collapsed. PATCO vanished in the aftermath, and the union movement as a whole suffered. **It was a step backwards that accelerated the decline of membership across the board in the private sector. Afterwards, unions as a whole suffered a continual decline of power during the Reagan administration**.Reagan himself had been a supporter of unions, but this event made him unpopular in their circles. It is possible that this event, which was a major loss to the Labor Movement, prompted a revival of its significance in the form of this film. -- Lyndsey Clark
 This film can definitely be considered a primary source to John Sayles the director. A website/blog post I read about this film talked about how Sayles made a book about this film entitled Thinking in Pictures: The Making of the Movie Matewan which came out in 1987. Supposedly in the book Sayles talked about how in the late 1960s he hitchhiked through this region which led him to become interested in West Virginia’s coal-mining district, its people, and their traditions. From this experience, Sayles was exposed to the miner's world and the different music, regional accents, and numerous local characters incorporated into this film. http://www.films42.com/feature/november_feature.asp -Megan Williams
@@ Line 92: / Line 92: @@
 https://millercenter.org/reagan-vs-air-traffic-controllers
 -Morgan Gilbert
+**Matewan has been the least “Hollywoodized” film we have watched so far.**  The fault of using fictional characters can be justified for its purpose of making historical figures real people.  The dialogue and ambiance are meant to be representative of the time period and puts you in the place rather than shows you.  The film’s release date of 1987 would be interesting to study in comparison to the film’s creation.  The era of Reagonomics and the effect of taxes on the working class and how viewers of this film at that time felt about it. -Janis Shurtleff
 I think this movie is a call to action against the government. Ronald Reagan became president in 1980, and his administration was severely anti-union. This movie was an attempt to show the way the government was trying to once again stop people from unionizing, and how big business was taking over.
@@ Line 97: / Line 99: @@
 --Cat Kinde
-I believe this movie shows a lot about the 1980s under Regan. Regan was particularly hard on unregulated unions. During Regan's presidency, there was an aircraft controller strike, they demanded higher wages and shorter hours. Regan upheld the idea that the companies must be respected by the workers. In “Matewan” Sayles takes the side of the Union workers, as he tries to emphasize the repressive actions of large companies against their workers. —Helen Dhue
+I believe this movie shows a lot about the 1980s under Regan. Regan was particularly hard on unregulated unions. During Regan's presidency, there was an aircraft controller strike, they demanded higher wages and shorter hours. Regan upheld the idea that the companies must be respected by the workers. **In “Matewan” Sayles takes the side of the Union workers, as he tries to emphasize the repressive actions of large companies against their workers.** —Helen Dhue
 ===== V. The "So, what?" question	======
-//Matewan// is an interesting movie. It is arguably one of the most historically accurate of the films we have seen so far. However, it does revolve around two completely fictional characters, Joe Kenehan and Danny Radnor. This is somewhat disconcerting because they both represent well a certain view in labor history. Joe is a pacifist who wants the union to accept everyone, including blacks and immigrants, so that they can work together to achieve their objectives. Danny can be related to the individuals who shared their first hand experiences of this massacre, mainly because the film is told from his perspective. The fact that the film revolves around fictional characters is more than a little disappointing. Sayles did a good job at trying to be as accurate to the coal miner's plight as possible, yet used fictional characters intermingled with historical ones to do so. The film could have just as easily been told from the perspective of an actual historical figure. -- Lyndsey Clark
+//Matewan// is an interesting movie. It is arguably one of the most historically accurate of the films we have seen so far. However, it does revolve around two completely fictional characters, Joe Kenehan and Danny Radnor. **This is somewhat disconcerting because they both represent well a certain view in labor history. Joe is a pacifist who wants the union to accept everyone, including blacks and immigrants, so that they can work together to achieve their objectives.** Danny can be related to the individuals who shared their first hand experiences of this massacre, mainly because the film is told from his perspective. The fact that the film revolves around fictional characters is more than a little disappointing. Sayles did a good job at trying to be as accurate to the coal miner's plight as possible, yet used fictional characters intermingled with historical ones to do so. The film could have just as easily been told from the perspective of an actual historical figure. -- Lyndsey Clark
-The film absolutely deserves commendation and praise for being wonderfully accurate to its sources, and deserves praise for its realism and dedication. However, I definitely think something needs to be said for the way this film was shot, and how it drags on for so unnecessarily long in certain places. The film, despite beingmade in 1989 feels like it is 20 years older, which is forgivable given the budget of the film, but far more entertaining films have been shot with a smaller budget. While the use of natural lighting is good in most scenes, this film in almost every scene is so dark, the sound design is not great and you definitely need subtitles to understand what is going on. To be perfectly honest, for once I with the directed had taken liberties or at least left scenes out for entertainment's sake, this is probably one of the most boring films we have seen so far, (besides Gone with the Wind, which is only more boring because of its abysmal runtime.) I do wish the director had shot scenes to be less bland, maybe shot scenes to be less dark, the film gets interesting and exciting for a few minutes but scenes that should be suspenseful, like when Few Clothes is going to kill Kehenan, end up feeling flat and boring and if you don't have subtitles on or pay very close attention, you have no idea what is supposed to be happening. This film is perfect for history students, would not recommend for a casual movie watcher, or anyone who doesn't already know the history behind it. One final point, the film ends when things begin, not when things end, the Matewan Massacre was the *beginning* of the Coalfield War, and led to the far bigger and more important Battle of Blair Mountain, which, along with Sid Hatfield's assassination, would have been a far more entertaining watch. The film just does not do enough to make you care about the characters, and does not even show how the Mayor or Kehenan gets shot.
+The film absolutely deserves commendation and praise for being wonderfully accurate to its sources, and deserves praise for its realism and dedication. However, I definitely think something needs to be said for the way this film was shot, and how it drags on for so unnecessarily long in certain places. The film, despite being made in 1989 feels like it is 20 years older, which is forgivable given the budget of the film, but far more entertaining films have been shot with a smaller budget. While the use of natural lighting is good in most scenes, this film in almost every scene is so dark, the sound design is not great and you definitely need subtitles to understand what is going on. To be perfectly honest, for once I with the directed had taken liberties or at least left scenes out for entertainment's sake, this is probably one of the most boring films we have seen so far, (besides Gone with the Wind, which is only more boring because of its abysmal runtime.) I do wish the director had shot scenes to be less bland, maybe shot scenes to be less dark, the film gets interesting and exciting for a few minutes but scenes that should be suspenseful, like when Few Clothes is going to kill Kehenan, end up feeling flat and boring and if you don't have subtitles on or pay very close attention, you have no idea what is supposed to be happening. This film is perfect for history students, would not recommend for a casual movie watcher, or anyone who doesn't already know the history behind it. One final point, the film ends when things begin, not when things end, the Matewan Massacre was the *beginning* of the Coalfield War, and led to the far bigger and more important Battle of Blair Mountain, which, along with Sid Hatfield's assassination, would have been a far more entertaining watch. The film just does not do enough to make you care about the characters, and does not even show how the Mayor or Kehenan gets shot.
-However this is all my opinion. Ultimately, the film is the example of historical accuracy affecting viewer interest in the film.--AJ DeGeorge
+However this is all my opinion. **Ultimately, the film is the example of historical accuracy affecting viewer interest in the film**.--AJ DeGeorge
 //Matewan// is one of the best movies we have watched so far. It's importance lies in its attention to historical accuracy. It does what a true historical film does, bringing attention to an unfamiliar story and portraying it as accurately as possible. Although it has fictional characters, I don't think this really hurts the film in any way. Compared to other films, it does an exceptional job in being both accurate and entertaining, despite what others may say. This is a bit funny, because it contradicts what Mel Gibson said when making //The Patriot//. Films that focus primarily on historical accuracy aren't always snooze fests. -- Jordan Petty
-I think that this film is an important addition to the list of films we have watched this semester. The struggle of coal miners and building labor unions, specifically this story, is not something well known. I personally did not know this story or this movie until this class. I think even with some historical inaccuracies like extra or inaccurate characters, the movie still does a good job staying fairly true to the story and giving the viewers what they want without adding or subtracting the things that are usually altered for the sake of ratings. I think this movie does a good job of being entertaining without sacrificing facts and gives the characters personality's that make it hard to not be invested in them. Overall I think this film is well made and creates a good frame of reference for the story of the Matewan Massacre. --Kimberly Sak
+I think that this film is an important addition to the list of films we have watched this semester. **The struggle of coal miners and building labor unions, specifically this story, is not something well known.** I personally did not know this story or this movie until this class. I think even with some historical inaccuracies like extra or inaccurate characters, the movie still does a good job staying fairly true to the story and giving the viewers what they want without adding or subtracting the things that are usually altered for the sake of ratings. I think this movie does a good job of being entertaining without sacrificing facts and gives the characters personality's that make it hard to not be invested in them. Overall I think this film is well made and creates a good frame of reference for the story of the Matewan Massacre. --Kimberly Sak
-This film stands out as //Matewan// actually tells the story of these miners and unions without overly-dramatizing or fictionalizing the story. There is a small amount of romance in the film that at least serves a purpose to move the narrative along and to demonstrate the damage that spies within a unionizing group could cause. This film is also important because it humanizes the unioning workers, something that often is not shown to people, particularly in America with "right to work states" and a view of unionizing as a socialist or communist construct to be feared. This film reminds Americans why these unions formed and the horrible working conditions and mistreatments they were fighting against and it's no coincidence that it came out in another period where people were protesting against unions in the 1980s after President Reagan's treatment of the Air Traffic Controllers. It makes an active effort to show the diverse cultures and conflicts in mining towns and to cover the radicalism, violence, and complexities of the early formation of labor unions. Ultimately it is a well-made film and I hope to use it or at least excerpts of it in my classroom to address the Matewan Massacre, the coal industry, and unions in the United States, and it contributes to the overall credibility of historical films.  - Ashley Dimino
+This film stands out as //Matewan// actually tells the story of these miners and unions without overly-dramatizing or fictionalizing the story. There is a small amount of romance in the film that at least serves a purpose to move the narrative along and to demonstrate the damage that spies within a unionizing group could cause. **This film is also important because it humanizes the unioning workers, something that often is not shown to people, particularly in America with "right to work states" and a view of unionizing as a socialist or communist construct to be feared.** This film reminds Americans why these unions formed and the horrible working conditions and mistreatments they were fighting against and it's no coincidence that it came out in another period where people were protesting against unions in the 1980s after President Reagan's treatment of the Air Traffic Controllers. It makes an active effort to show the diverse cultures and conflicts in mining towns and to cover the radicalism, violence, and complexities of the early formation of labor unions. Ultimately it is a well-made film and I hope to use it or at least excerpts of it in my classroom to address the Matewan Massacre, the coal industry, and unions in the United States, and it contributes to the overall credibility of historical films.  - Ashley Dimino
 This film is important because it is about a relatively unknown portion of American history.  People may know child labor existed, working conditions were bad, and there was corruption in this time period, but few people know the extent of any of these realities.  The film tells a largely accurate version of each of these details in horrifying and brutal ways.  The audience sees how crooked companies could be and still get away with their deeds.  It is important for audiences to know these areas of history.  Most movies focus on wars or other areas of history while few tell the story of events like the Matewan Massacre.  As a result, this film is important, especially because it is fairly accurate. -Daniel Walker
@@ Line 119: / Line 121: @@
 I think this is a pretty important topic when learning about American history so a movie that portrays it well is a great thing to see. Working class struggles in America aren't something people generally learn about, especially how radical some of the movements were. Thanks to unions we live much better lives than 100 years ago. The 8 hour work day, paid sick leave, minimum wage laws, and so much more is all taken for granted today but was fought so hard for back in the day, many times resulting in actual wars between workers and bosses. This is definitely a topic more Americans should be exposed to, the actual struggle for unionization, the long history of class divisions in America, and the power of the union are all still relevant topics today. - Wilson
-I feel like the topic of workers struggles is largely overlooked in schools. When I was younger I remember probably learning about a couple strikes and then ending with the conclusion that people like the Pinkertons and Baldwin-Felts were just badass detectives. Organized labor is still an important topic today and in 2018 Union membership hit a record low here in the U.S. I believe there is a chance that this may change as we are headed into a different era politically in the U.S. Many ideals that died with FDR and were destroyed by the Cold War are making a resurgence. - Dan Dilks
+I feel like the topic of workers struggles is largely overlooked in schools. When I was younger I remember probably learning about a couple strikes and then ending with the conclusion that people like the Pinkertons and Baldwin-Felts were just badass detectives.** Organized labor is still an important topic today and in 2018 Union membership hit a record low here in the U.S.** I believe there is a chance that this may change as we are headed into a different era politically in the U.S. Many ideals that died with FDR and were destroyed by the Cold War are making a resurgence. - Dan Dilks
+I feel like this film at least attempts to give a voice to  truly communities in rural Appalachia, by simply putting mountain communities on screen It tries- albeit very imperfectly- to portray applicable folks in this part of the country as intelligent and autonomous, if if they are without a formal education. They are not saved by a well-educated high-brow flatfoot, as is the case with many movies about rural America. As a matter of fact, they weren't "rescued" at all. Even today, poorer folks in what many in cities have referred to as "flyover country" are forgotten or abused by Richmond, Charleston, and Washington, and yet they move on and embrace their work.
+Occasionally, a few will even save up some money to help their children grandchildren get a secondary education head off to college, grateful for the time their family labored in mills, mines, or tobacco fields. Then, we get to hear college people wax eloquent about their intellectual superiority to our friends and family who are just uneducated hicks who don't really know what's good for their own communities. True story. (Not referring to anyone in this class, don't worry.) -Ethan